Ryan Adams sucks and Wilco fans are snobs.

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sab
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Ryan Adams sucks and Wilco fans are snobs.

Post by sab » Mon Aug 26, 2002 10:50 am

All right, in the same vain as the "Fuck You, Elliot" comment on the Wilco movie feature, I want to better understand the whole Ryan Adams-Wilco argument.

Someone clue me in, please...

Phineas
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Post by Phineas » Mon Aug 26, 2002 11:34 am

All right, as the one being invited to be fucked, I'll take a stab. I think a lot of it stems from a largely apocryphal rivalry between the acts themselves. They've both taken pretty minor potshots at one another during shows and the odd interview here and there. None of it was particularly nasty though. I have a feeling it came from frustration at being lumped together by idiot journalists who thought Wilco was still writing Uncle Tupelo inspired music 5 years after UT broke up. I mean if you're Jeff Tweedy, trying to promote Summerteeth, and keep getting questions about this drunk with a Steve Earle compulsion, it might get on your nerves after a while too.

As for the fans, I just don't know. Adams' fans seem pretty touchy about anyone criticizing their guy. That seems to just make his critics want to do it even more. I don't know if it's still there, but anyone interested should check out the transcription from an AOL chat room Adams supposedly participated in. It was on the Old 97's site, but it may not be around anymore. It was funny as hell. Anyone have this saved?

Sugarcubes Forever
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Post by Sugarcubes Forever » Mon Aug 26, 2002 12:52 pm

Ok Sab, I think Ryan Adams sucks!!!!!!!!

Burn him at the stake with Elliot Smiths at his side. Then, burn their fans too.

sab
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Post by sab » Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:03 pm

As usual, Scotty, your determination to avoid saying anything of relevance or merit is to be admired.

Jake
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Post by Jake » Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:31 pm

Tweedy made a comment in an interview something like, "If you really want to hear records that sound like 1996-era Wilco, you've still got Ryan Adams." I can't seem to find the source for that quote, but here's another funny one: http://events.calendarlive.com/top/1,14 ... 47,00.html
Jeff Tweedy is standing outside a small studio at radio station KCRW-FM in Santa Monica, waiting to lead his band Wilco through its paces, when somebody waves what might be a red flag in front of him--a newspaper article on Ryan Adams.

Will this reminder of his presumed rival's celebrity plunge Tweedy into a spell of his famous melancholy? The singer just glances at the page and flashes a half-smile.

"It's funny," he says. "We have the same lawyer in New York, and I went into his office and saw this picture on his wall. I said 'Hey, I don't remember doing that show.'"

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Post by thousandfold » Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:55 pm

I said "fuck you, Elliot," because his comment was meant as a personal affront to Ryan Adams fans, and I took it as such. I wasn't upset that someone dare criticize Ryan - he's a big boy; he can take care of himself.
The feud between Ryan Adams and Wilco is largely the product of a couple of offhand comments and the media's desire to see feuding. Neither of them care enough to have an actual feud. And btw, last I heard, the Ryan Adams-Old 97's feud was long over.
I love Ryan Adams' music. His albums changed my life. And Yankee Hotel Foxtrot changed my life. And isn't that really what it's all about?

D. Phillips
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Post by D. Phillips » Mon Aug 26, 2002 2:45 pm

Yes it is, Katie. And don't let any of these fuckers tell you different.

I too am a fan of Wilco and Ryan Adams and am also one who doesn't see a lot of similarities between the two. As a fan, I am critical of Adam's last effort (Gold) as I don't think it stands up to the greatness of Heartbreaker. Attitude aside, Ryan Adams is a good songwriter and I'd liek to see him return to the stripped feel of Heartbreaker. How's that for a pinch of actual criticism and discussion?

sraparel

Ryan Adams

Post by sraparel » Mon Aug 26, 2002 3:36 pm

I'm not a huge Ryan Adams fan but I do have a certain amount of respect for him. I think you have to recognize his work with Whiskeytown, who were definitely a decent band. All this anti-Adams sentiment seems to stem from a backlash against the publicity he's getting right now, which won't last. Like the good old Strokes, he's not a bad artist himself but he's nothing special or brilliant. I'll also have you note I like alt-country but am not extremely passionate about it.
Here's a side comment for you also: I didn't think Being There was that great of an album. It isn't bad but it blatently rips of country-fied moments by The Band, Neil Young (Harvest era), and throws in a bit of the Replacements. Nothing special. On the other hand, YHF is incredible.

Jake
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Post by Jake » Mon Aug 26, 2002 3:40 pm

I too love Heartbreaker, but I consider it to be pretty much a fluke, along with the handful of good Whiskeytown songs I've heard. I think Ryan Adams is a pretting boring songwriter overall with aspirations to add a "B" to the beginning of his name by recording lite-schlock that would sound perfect on the soundtrack to a movie about Robin Hood starring Kevin Costner. Whiskeytown's country stuff is so note-for-note over-the-top copycat classic country that there's no reason to listen to it rather than the real stuff that inspired it.

Heartbreaker's great though. And so is the song "Factory Girl" (not the Stones song of the same name). But that's pretty much it.

D. Phillips
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Post by D. Phillips » Mon Aug 26, 2002 3:52 pm

I agree with the sentiment, but not all of what the Old Man wrote. There's more to Whiskeytown than "Factory Girl," but not much. I agree that the vast majority is so poorly produced and schmaltzy that you could hear it side-by-side with Michael Bolton.

But I don't think Ryan Adams is a boring songwriter, I think he has no editing ability. He releases so much stuff in so many styles that it seems like he's just trying to appease everyone. I think most creative types produce a lot of material. The key is to sort through the shit and get to the genius stuff. Hemingway wrote tons of material that we're now finding, upon posthumous publishing, wasn't so great. Dig through any great songwriter's catalog and you're bound to find some crap (need I mention Neil's Geffen years or even his latest album?)

Case in point: Ryan Adams is about to release a "demos" album ( http://www.ryan-adams.com/music.html ). Now, that's great news for mega-fans who live for this shit (like the whole GLONO staff for various other artists), but it also puts out for critical evaluation a batch of songs that, by definition, aren't quite finished.

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